Inner CV Joint Removal

[capriblu]

Noticed a slight knocking noise coming from front left of car a couple of days ago.  This has developed over the weekend and manifests itself as a light consistent knock primarily on deceleration and disappears when clutch is dipped.  I'm 90% certain this is a failing inner CV joint so have a new item on order and will look to replace over next couple of days.

I'm planning on being able to do this without having to undo the hub.  How easy is this to do ?   Any tips regarding procedure etc .. ?

Thanks,

Andrew

[SanRemo78]

It's a simple enough mechanical procedure but access is tight and is best done with the shaft on the bench. There are six Allen headed bolts on the inner CV with three locking tabs behind. Initially you can release the bolts as there is a step in the flange stopping the nuts rotating but you'll need a spanned eventually. If you can remove the staked outer CV nut the shaft can be removed easily enough. I'd recommend this route as, with the shaft on the bench, it's a simple job to clean it and replace the outer boot too, cleaning old grease out is a messy task but doing it and replacing with new should be a routine service job every 5-10 years!. The inner CV is held on with a simple circlip which will be covered in grease! If you're doing this job yourself please ensure that the car is safely supported on axle stands before getting underneath it.
Guy

[capriblu]

Thanks for this - Just not sure how easily I'll be able to undo the hub nut with just a 1/2" breaker rather than a decent impact wrench.  I'll have a go !

[peteracs]

Hi Andrew

The alternative is maybe a little less painful, remove the whole hub...... you will need to disconnect the track rod ball joint probably anyway, so that would just leave the lower ball joint. As you say removing the hub nut without an impact is non trivial often and sometimes with an impact it is difficult. I originally made a simple angle iron bar to bolt to the hub to stop the hub rotating and hence not put strain on the diff, also useful when assembling and tightening the nut.

Peter

[capriblu]

Thanks Peter - was thinking along those lines if hub nut proves difficult to budge (which I expect it will).  Presumably this would just provide the necessary mobility and movement of the shaft to allow the inner bearing to be removed and replaced, i.e. not complete removal of the hub/carrier?

[peteracs]

Hi

I was thinking of removing the whole hub from the car. Once you have detached the caliper and removed the disk, then it is just two ball joints and the two strut bolts.

Much easier to work on the bench.

Peter

[Neil-yaj396]

Just a suggestion, but could it be a wheel bearing rather than the CV joint?

I had a really bad 'hum' last year that disappeared with the clutch disengaged and it was a failing bearing.

[capriblu]

Thanks again Peter - that makes sense and should be (famous last words) straightforward.  The suspension was apart quite recently for re-bushing, so hopefully ball joints etc. will come apart quite easily.

Hi Neil, thanks for suggestion but not a bearing - its a mechanical loud tapping speed related noise almosting clunk that occurs when decelerating and in drive.  I'm 99% certain its coming from inner CV joint.  Just manually grabbing driveshaft on nearside and moving back and forth there is a lot of slop.  The offside is not great but doesnt feel quite as loose as the nearside.  If I can get inner CV joint replaced quickly and painlessly I can plan to replace all joints this winter.

[WestonE]

On Montes we have a spate of loose output flanges on the gear box that give the symptom you describe so worth checking the flange nut is actually done up not simply staked still loose!. Obviously only 1 flange on most Betas.

[lancialulu]

On Montes we have a spate of loose output flanges on the gear box that give the symptom you describe so worth checking the flange nut is actually done up not simply staked still loose!. Obviously only 1 flange on most Betas.

Good call (and anyway you really need to get the bolts up tight when putting back together). My Fulvia went through its annual MOT and they picked up loose bolts on drivers side. Not picked up for the 5 years since I changed the gearbox and I do these up really tight anyway after hearing disasters. Could not believe but 2 bolts were almost out....

And it shows the importance of MOTs even if like me you do all your own work but you cant check everything all the time....

[WestonE]

This is a job where only brand new P type (deep) M8 nyloc nuts will do. The paranoid might add Loctite. These bolts just vibrate loose and old nylocs will not do the job.

[capriblu]

On Montes we have a spate of loose output flanges on the gear box that give the symptom you describe so worth checking the flange nut is actually done up not simply staked still loose!. Obviously only 1 flange on most Betas.

Good call (and anyway you really need to get the bolts up tight when putting back together). My Fulvia went through its annual MOT and they picked up loose bolts on drivers side. Not picked up for the 5 years since I changed the gearbox and I do these up really tight anyway after hearing disasters. Could not believe but 2 bolts were almost out....

And it shows the importance of MOTs even if like me you do all your own work but you cant check everything all the time....

Thanks for this -

So I have removed the whole drive shaft assembly complete with the hub from the car - relatively quick and painless process!  I've now decided to replace both inner and outer CV joints as well as wheel bearing all together simply to avoid risk of having to strip down again in the near future.   A colleague and black belt garagista with full workshop facilties in his garage (tools, press etc..) will assist.

I did check the castle lock nut on the inner CV joint flange and whilst it was "staked" albeit only at one point I did sense that it is not particularly tight.  The backlash between the flange and the diff output spline was quite noticable (I would estimate about 015/020 " radial movement) - not sure whether lock not tightness should really be critical in reducing play between flange and shaft ?

I've attempted to "de stake" and will find a suitable castle nut socket to check tightness.  Does anybody know size and spec - is it the same as the Monte ones?    Is it safe to tighten against engaged transmission?

[Ics19]

The loose nut doesn't sound good, equally the single stake is ominous, but you'll probably get away with re-using the nut.  I've used a ground down old chisel to get a good fit on the stake area - a curved side can ease the staking back out quite well.  You really need to lock the flange to do it up with something solid bolted on to the holes, as the torque is ~160 Nm about 115 ft lb.  The nuts are the same as monte ones as are the joints/bolts/nuts:  https://www.eurosport-uk.net/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=51_67&products_id=1080

If you can't borrow a tool, then a suitable old socket might benefit from a little angle grinding to fit the castellations - at least you have the benefit of having a nut off the car to check the fit easily.  The LMC used to hire the tool, but I don't think it was an original Lancia one and wasn't the greatest condition IIRC.