Author Topic: DATR conversion to electric choke?  (Read 8428 times)

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Offline JohnFol

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DATR conversion to electric choke?
« on: November 25, 2025, 10:29:21 AM »
Morning all, can runs really well but I know the choke is a bit problematic.
Toying with the idea of replacing the automatic choke driven by water temperature with the electric equivalent.

Has anyone done that, or has a cautionary tale why it's a bad idea?

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2025, 07:27:43 PM »
my electric choke seems to work okay
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
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Offline Nigel

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2025, 10:18:31 PM »
John,
These coolant chokes are normally reliable if set up correctly and
achieving good flow-through.
Due to the small apertures involved, especially at the extreme ends, i.e. the manifold
and lower water rail, flow can become restricted by crud build-up. The bowl can
also get blocked easily.

There are alignment marks on the bowl, I find they are generally accurate and useful.

Mark, I'm sure yours is standard coolant-driven.

Nigel

1984 2.0 Carb HPE [ex Aus] Grigio Finanza.
2007 Mazda 6 2.3 [current daily, highly recommended]
The past:
1980 2.0 HPE White in South Africa [hope it survives!]
1976 1.6 Coupe Lancia Blu [PFG 76R] [probably deceased]
oh,and an Uno Turbo 1997 also in SA [stolen,never recovered]

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2025, 11:14:05 PM »
nope, its electric heated
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA

Offline peteracs

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2025, 01:00:04 AM »
nope, its electric heated

That I would like to see..

Peter
Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600

Offline Nigel

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2025, 06:50:01 AM »
Interesting.
What's the model type stamped on the flange?

Nigel
1984 2.0 Carb HPE [ex Aus] Grigio Finanza.
2007 Mazda 6 2.3 [current daily, highly recommended]
The past:
1980 2.0 HPE White in South Africa [hope it survives!]
1976 1.6 Coupe Lancia Blu [PFG 76R] [probably deceased]
oh,and an Uno Turbo 1997 also in SA [stolen,never recovered]

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2025, 02:58:57 PM »
I know it off by heart now

34 DAT 2/251 which matches my late version Lancia Service Manual (Jan 1982), jets are all over the place.  Sorry just realised this is someone elses post...
« Last Edit: November 26, 2025, 03:16:10 PM by Ferrit »
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA

Offline Nigel

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2025, 07:37:22 PM »
Mark,
For John's and our benefit, please post a pic of the electric choke, thanks.

Nigel
1984 2.0 Carb HPE [ex Aus] Grigio Finanza.
2007 Mazda 6 2.3 [current daily, highly recommended]
The past:
1980 2.0 HPE White in South Africa [hope it survives!]
1976 1.6 Coupe Lancia Blu [PFG 76R] [probably deceased]
oh,and an Uno Turbo 1997 also in SA [stolen,never recovered]

Offline JohnFol

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2025, 08:32:14 PM »
I know it off by heart now

34 DAT 2/251 which matches my late version Lancia Service Manual (Jan 1982), jets are all over the place.  Sorry just realised this is someone elses post...

Not a problem.
Ditto the comment about what the electric one looks like

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2025, 10:00:57 PM »
when I am in the garage I will take a photo.  Its basically this

https://classiccarbs.co.uk/product/57804-333r-weber-carburettor-12v-electric-auto-choke-mechanism/

its powered off the solenoid feed, not that my car is the best to follow  :D
« Last Edit: November 26, 2025, 10:04:51 PM by Ferrit »
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA

Offline peteracs

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2025, 10:34:24 PM »
Hi Mark

Solenoid on the carb? Not sure that makes any sense, must be powered by something temp related or manually ( that would defeat having it as an auto choke).

Peter
Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2025, 11:17:30 PM »
I assumed it heats up and winds the lever to open the choke.  It does work
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA

Offline peteracs

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2025, 07:15:28 AM »
Hi Mark

Yes, but what causes it to heat up is really my question. Ie the heating up process must be triggered by some event related to temp of the engine? On the wet system this is caused by the flow of hot water, so something must trigger the power to be applied to the heating element? Or am I misunderstanding how it works?

Peter
Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2025, 12:04:16 PM »
I can test this theory when the bonnet it up next time.

I think there is a perm 12v supply when ignition is on to the anti overrun solenoid and choke mechanism.  This makes sense as the solenoid uses power to keep it from cutting fuel until you kill the ignition.  The coil inside the choke mechanism heats up and rolls back the choke flap over an x period of time.  I will do a video over time when it’s back up and running.

Found this:

An electric choke heats the bimetal with an electric heating element to pull the choke off after a certain period of time. A non-electric does the same thing, but uses either hot water or hot air from the manifold as the pull-off assist.

On an electric choke there is usually a small set of contacts that break once the bimetal opens past a certain point to kill the current requirement.
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA

Offline peteracs

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2025, 01:32:57 PM »
Hi

Ok so I guess it assumes that start of heating is start of engine and the time it takes for the bimetallic strip uncurl  is approx the time it takes for engine to warm up. Crude, but I guess effective.

It would be interesting to know what markets they were sold in and when

Peter
Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600

Online Ics19

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2025, 02:40:01 PM »
Yes, certainly an alternative to decaying coolant cover ports  :) 

On an electric choke there is usually a small set of contacts that break once the bimetal opens past a certain point to kill the current requirement.

I'd be surprised if there was a switch as wouldn't the bi-metal then cool down allowing the choke to close once again?

I'd guess the downside is that the choke might re-activate after a fuel stop for instance, while a water controlled version should still be be hot enough to keep the choke off.

That said, on the last X1/9s which had a 34 DATR 28/250, the water operated choke has a "resistor heater" similar to:
https://www.webcon.co.uk/products/3637-resistor/
This is inserted against the bi-metal unit instead of the plastic spacer and is controlled by an extra thermo switch in the thermostat housing to heat up the choke unit to keep the choke off if the main engine is hot, as the coolant at the choke could have cooled after a stop.  Not saying it's a better idea, and personally not found the simple coolant choke itself an issue - the main problems have always been leaks at the hoses which can corrode the bi-metal unit or the choke flap spindle sticking necessitating a good clean.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2025, 07:55:35 PM by Ics19 »

Offline JohnFol

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2025, 03:19:05 PM »
Could always add a simple circuit to the 12v that takes a feed from temp sensor in cylinder head....

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2025, 05:00:31 PM »
It seems to work a-okay in its current state.  I had definitely had similar on cars BitD

Looking at Peter's wiring diagram its corresponds with a red feed from the ignition switch

https://lanciabeta.co.uk/forum/Downloads/Beta-Coupe-RHD-S4-wiring-Password-neromoto.pdf
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA

Offline JohnFol

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2025, 07:02:02 PM »
Did you get a chance to photo it on the car?

when I am in the garage I will take a photo.  Its basically this

https://classiccarbs.co.uk/product/57804-333r-weber-carburettor-12v-electric-auto-choke-mechanism/

its powered off the solenoid feed, not that my car is the best to follow  :D

Online Ferrit

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Re: DATR conversion to electric choke?
« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2025, 10:17:50 PM »
sorry its still in bits in my shed waiting for the float hanger to come back from being repaired.  I did take this.

I also have a video I could share that shows it, or give me a week at it should be getting back together hopefully

PS - what exactly do you need?
« Last Edit: December 14, 2025, 10:20:18 PM by Ferrit »
Lancia Beta Coupe 2000 SA import, now project
VW Caravelle t5.1 was project
Merc EQA